notrydoyoda Posted January 2012
The Caregiver & Dysfunctional Families: How are you doing?
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“Smile at strangers and you just might change a life.”
She empathized with your pain.
Someone who invalidates your pain will say something like if you think that's bad, you should hear my story or something like I have my own problems. A person who is trying to compete with your pain is never empathetic. No, they try to put your pain down as they push theirs up.
She was doing the opposite by being empathetic
It is sad that she felt the need to put herself down which struck me as signifying that she didn't really hear what you were saying about pain doesn't need comparing for each person's pain is their pain. I think she's had experiences in the past when upon sharing about her pain someone competed with it and thus made her feel put down.
The book below comes with many recomendations on the forum. I finally read it last year & am so glad I did.
Never Simple: A Memoir, by Liz Scheier
"Never Simple is the story of learning to survive―and, finally, trying to save―a complicated parent..."
But also about how it is ok to stop.
“Some people are mad at you because you aren’t suffering, and they want you to.”
Interviewer: Why do you want to work in customer service?
Me: Well, I’m really good at apologizing for things that aren’t my fault.
“If you’re reading this, I hope something great happens to you today.”
“You know how to tell when someone is miserable with their own life? When they look for ways to destroy someone else’s.”
today's wisdom quote:
"Don't feed the flying monkeys."
"I am convinced that the hardest language to speak for some is the 'truth'."
"Beware the person who stabs you and then tells the world they're the one who's bleeding."
"No one is going to give you the education you need to overthrow them."
“One of the best lines in the movie ‘9 to 5’, which should be told to every Narc on a pity party (‘Honey, get off the cross, we need the wood.’)”
My father wants me try and reconcile with them, but honestly at this point, I can go either way with them. You don't need a lot of hatred at my level of cancer, you need support.
It’s your decision .
I only went because I could not decide .
So I went , DH and kids came to run interference to help me dodge siblings as much as possible , although two had some ridiculous comments about how “ we all helped and visited Mom after Dad died “
NOT !!! I did 95% of the work and caught all the criticism .
Anyway as soon as the funeral was over My DH and I and my two kids hightailed it out of there for the 4 hour ride home . Did not join the family for the Irish funeral after party.
We stopped at McDonalds on the way home in honor of Mom , she loved their French fries .🍟🍟🍟
I’ve gone to the cemetery a few times . I bring Dad hot tea and Mom French fries and flowers . 🙄🙄. I know it’s silly .
“It’s a good day
to scream into your pillow.”
Yes and that involves getting free from the trauma bond.
Another thing that can happen, but not always nor automatically is that the child of a narcissist will develop some traits as a means of survival and they can get help for those, what I call mental health flees.
I wish you the best in your journey.
Thanks for asking. By fleas, I mean traits that get developed on the surface of our personalities as a defense or coping mechanism. They are not really engrained parts of our personality, but they are there on the surface which means that they can come off.
Ok, I found an article that explains this much better. I can write out the link, but I don't think that I can post the link.
"Fleas - When a non-personality-disordered individual (Non-PD) begins imitating or emulating some of the disordered behavior of a loved one or family member with a personality disorder this is sometimes referred to as "getting fleas".
Fleas comes from the adage “Lie down with dogs and you are bound to get fleas”.
Sometimes, when a person has been exposed to an abusive situation for a sustained period, they will look for ways to escape - and sometimes they will experiment or resort to behaviors which are not characteristic but serve as a mechanism to demonstrate their anger.
These behaviors are often destructive and counter-productive and rarely get the abuse victim what they want. These behaviors usually result in regret, shame and apologies from the abuse victim towards their perpetrator. Some perpetrators may seize on such incidents as justification for their own abusive behavior or as a diversion from it.
Some Examples of Fleas
A submissive partner who occasionally becomes violent towards an abusive person or towards their property.
A placid individual who engages in name-calling, shouting or slander.
A faithful spouse who decides to have an affair.
What it Feels Like
If you have been living for a long time with a person who suffers from a personality disorder, chances are you have been living with the 3 dreadful companions - hopelessness, helplessness and powerlessness. Like an animal forced into a corner it is quite common to have the instinct to fight your way out of it.
Anger is a feeling that comes instinctively when we feel we aren't getting what we deserve. When we feel angry, our bodies produce adrenaline, our breathing rate and heart rate quicken. Our ability to think objectively and perform other maintenance tasks is reduced as our bodies instinctively divert resources towards our "fight or flight" mechanisms. We become like a tightly-wound spring.
However, most Non-PD's are more accustomed to "keeping the peace" than being aggressors and most of us are not comfortable or accomplished in winning arguments or fights.
We will often back down or feel remorse after lashing out. We may begin to compare our behavior to that of the person with the personality disorder and wonder if we are the ones who have "the" problem. It is common for Non-PD's to begin to question if they are the one who suffers from a personality disorder. It is also common for Non-PD's to greatly fear retribution after an angry outburst and engage in a manipulative campaign, similar to hoovering to try to deflect consequences or payback.
What NOT to do
If you find you are doing things that you are not proud of and think you may be getting fleas:
Don't fight fire with fire with a person who is abusing you - you will just feel twice the heat.
Don't use their poor choices as an excuse or justification for making bad choices of your own.
Don't allow your own bad choices to be used as an excuse for somebody else's bad behavior. Everyone gets to be responsible for their own stuff.
What TO do
Learn all you can about personality disorders and the abusive cycle.
Get yourself a support network where you can discuss things that concern you without feeling judged.
Work on setting Boundaries that will help you escape the feelings of helplessness, hopelessness and powerlessness.
Take along a friend or therapist if appropriate and confront the behaviors of your abuser in an assertive, rather than an aggressive way.
Promptly remove yourself and any innocent children from any verbally or physically abusive situations.
I will post again.
Here is the address for the website where the article came from.
https://outofthefog.website/what-not-to-do-1/2015/12/3/fleas
One man I know whose wife has borderline personality disorder shocked me when he told me about his one night affair with TMI which gave me mental image of the person. He and his wife did get therapy. However, he told me that one of the first things the therapist said was to his wife, "your husband is not a bad man, this was a coping response to your sickness." I'm not sure how, but they are still together. Sometimes a rape victim in anger and hurt will return to the scene of the event but carry an automatic rifle which is not like her, but it gives her a sense of control and closure. Often times girls who grow up with not much of a dad will go wild looking for love in all the wrong places literally. I met several of those in high school even in Christian groups who in a secluded area would come on super strong. Many in the sex industry who are not there because of human trafficking are there because a family member raped them. They hate the men who they make money off of. Sorry, I'm so full of extreme examples and I'm not saying any of these could be at anytime possible of you. But these are the things that people get caught up with that began with being bitten by fleas and either not be able or just not getting help they end up somewhere that is really not them.
You are welcome. "Doing things to his bed in anger or in his bed as a selfish escape? Either would be a flea because it would be more like a narcissist.
As far as time goes, tell me about it. I already had been dealing with toxic memories from my childhood and teen years, but I've been in therapy since 2009 when the really bad stuff, buried memories, came to mind. I've made a lot of progress. Most of my coping habits are behind me. As a statement on TikTok once said, 'you will come to despise what you were once so attracted to when you heal.' True, at the same time though, I have one coping mechanism that declines and rises according to how my emotions are, being triggered, plus returning or new memories.
Well, enough about me. I wish you the very best in dealing with your own fleas so we can all be as free of fleas as we can actually be!
Good. I'm glad that your caught yourself and self regulated in a different direction.
We must have boundaries to help us avoiding becoming who we aren't.
I guess you have to risk not being liked if you want to be your authentic self.
I've related this all on this forum before but it bears repeating especially if someone out there can relate and does not feel so alone knowing others feel the same.
There is a difference between "needs" and "wants". Your job, if you chose to do it, is about making sure your parents/relatives are safe, have food, shelter, finances in order, i.e. see that their needs are met, but not to look after all their wants. Looking after their needs is a big job. Looking after their wants too can make the job impossible. Looking after more than one person becomes a too heavy burden often. You are only one and you have to look after yourself too, or the whole thing falls apart.
Can you give us more information about what is dragging you down?
Does your family have any other resources -e;g; money to hire some help, or go into a facility?
This situation has to work for all concerned and that includes you. Take care of you!!!
Hi Anxietynacy - happy to hear that you've thankfully had a few good days this week...and yes, I can totally agree and relate to the "rollarcoaster" that caregiving brings. I think caregiving is insidious...it starts little by little ...and before you know it, you're on overdrive and you don't even recognize yourself or your own life anymore.
I think my feeling "numb" these days seems to be my only way to get thru stressful situations - to put "blinders" on in order to move forward. I realize that it's not the best way to live - it eventually backs up on me. I think today was one of those days. I'm feeling a bit blue - and that's not typical of my natural personality...but a person can only take so much.
I'm trying to assist parents and a single aunt - they're all in their early 90's....it's a small family and basically all on me - my sister stays in the background...every now and then, she'll make a very small effort, but only when she sees the impact it's having on me. And of course, none of them planned for their senior years. And, when it comes to dysfunctional families, they're right up there! I could write a book.
Hi Golden - your wise words and direction actually helped me to take a deep breath and center me - really thank you. What's dragging me down is I think caregiving is such an isolating feeling - I suppress most of it. I've tried to organize as much as possible for them - ordering their groceries weekly...getting meals sent...taking care of all of their mail, bill paying and finances - bringing in a housekeeper once a week to keep their homes clean and laundry, etc...but I get pulled into their urgencies and issues and crisis situations that arise and I'm constantly going back and forth leaving the city and going there ...and I've struggled with doing anything for them, being that I've suffered significant emotional and physical abuse by them in my adult years. It's still very hard to speak about.
I'm just trying my best right now - just praying each day and trying to get back to the me that I once was. Thank you both for listening and for your supportive words...it helped a lot!
Sending you both much love ~
Happy to hear that you're pacing yourself and letting others do the work while taking a break. That's very important to take this time to recharge - you owe it to yourself and your own life! And who needs to be popular with a dysfunctional family anyway! I've made friends my family these days.
I'm trying hard to be more cognizant of my own life and for my own self care. We need to make sure to take care of ourselves!
Sending you my very best wishes and much appreciation ~
'Mission creep' is a term I learnt on this forum.
I saw it as a slide into a bog. A deep sticky bog. Once in it took time to feel the reality. Where am I? How to climb out?
I am also feeling so alone. I also have the 'background sibling'. So background..
I went to visit. To discuss it all. Never got a word in... so focused on their lives.. younger kids. I get it. But still so alone. Having a cry tonight.
But hope lives. I met a kind pastural care worker today. That was a positive.