The Caregiver & Dysfunctional Families: How are you doing?

cmagum good to see you posting and hope you are doing ok.

QuechuaCare67, there are some threads here about dealing with narcissistic parents. You can search for them using the search site in the upper right hand corner of this page.

Quechua~If you could provide some additional details such as are you living with your parents? Is your father's health declining and needs care that your mother is not providing? What is your mother's health situation aside from being narcissistic? This information will help us to provide you with support and information for your situation.

I'm thinking dealing with a narcissistic parent could be another thread! This is my first post here...and I need to figure how to stop argung with my mom...since as a narcissist it doesn't change her reality...and only makes me angry and/or feel guilty. But as an adult, I feel like I can and should stick up for my dad who has been the subject of her abuse since day one. Lot's of co-dependency issues obviously. She seems pleasant in her demeanor...but people don't see that nothing is ever good enough, she does nothing to improve her life but blames everyone else for it, makes up lies about her life and our family's life to make herself look superior and "prove" that her life has been so hard...when in reality she has been VERY privileged. I AM SO FRUSTRATED!!!

Hi Ladee,

I was just reading your post about your work situation.
I'm very sorry that these two younger workers are making you feel this way.

While I was growing up, being the eldest of four siblings a lot was expected of me since my two parents were working full time. So we had no stay at home mom. Guess who became that person. My parents each in their own ways, favored my siblings for a variety of reasons, so there was definitely lots of favoritism at play in the family dynamics.

So I know for certain that this influenced the way I behave in situations, especially current day since my mom now is 92 yrs.old and my sister lives w/her, administrating the care w/paid caregivers. So if it's that I go there to relieve my sister when needed, or just to visit mom I on occassion get some kind of comment/dig/guilt trip by my sister who seems to think she's going to run things her way, no matter what. Now I understand when you say that you are on a healing path, and as I understand want to take the high road. I try doing the same w/my sister. She usually tries to do these kinds of things as a way also to make herself out to be the martyr, because that's who SHE is.

I realize that in a work scenario this is different, because all of you are getting paid to do this. But anyway, do you think these people are trying to look better in the eyes of your employer by this behavior? I would suggest if I may, as did Sharyn that you document some of this. We all want to take the hight road, but even I unfortunately get my buttons pushed by my sister even if I try not to allow this. But this is in a family dynamics.

Your feelings are valid, don't ignore them. Be aware w/these two co-workers.
Anyway, it is good that M & S's needs come first for you, and that their family realizes the truth of the matter. Lots of Love & Light! Margeaux

Yes, it is true that people who are not responsive can hear. I know from personal experience for 8 days.

It is true people who are not responsive can hear -we had a pt. years ago who was in a coma and some staff mostly nurses talked in front of her -they were sure she could not hear-well she did recover completely and told of what she had heard while in the coma. My husband was unresponsive most of the last two days of his life and he knew who was talking to him he would squeeze someones hand and try to smile with everyone but me-with me he would pretend he did not hear me and acted different with our son and daughter and granddaughter-I know he was trying to hurt me-he was big on punishments all our marriage-it was so hard on me I blocked it out in my mind until months later istarted thinking about it-that was the day my rings came off-and I knew he meant it when he always said he hated me.

Sharynmare, I think I remember you saying you worked in seed saving. We ate the best tomatoe EVER tonight and want to save the seeds. I have looked and looked, but can't find what you wrote about saving seeds. If you have time, could you post it again, or send me a note on my wall? We'd be grateful! Thanks, kimbee

U565425,

Oh, I re-read my post, sorry for some typos.
Margeaux

Hi U565425,
First of all, I'd like to thank you for a hug you posted, I believe it was almost a month ago. You sent me an explanation about your situation of which I had a lot of questions. Anyway, I noticed you'd been communicating more w/some others on this thread.

WOW! What a family story. Honestly U565, how do you deal w/your mom and sister!! I comment you for the trouble, and obvious good involvement you've shown w/your dad's health. What is it about other family members that do sabotage? Does your mother have some mental health issues?

Anyway, I feel for you that you had that ID theft committed against you and your husband, no less as I understood by your own sister!
I guess once the Dept. of Family Services has been enlisted it can get ugly, which is more than apparent by what you've described, of the nursing home trying to bar your visits to your dad.

Well this other post I read later re: your dad having signed over the DPOA, all orchestrated by your mother!! Given all the details you wrote, that he has had issues w/alcohol, brain damage how could a signature for DPOA be valid!
Maybe you should go speak to an attorney about this matter.

But I realize also, that when you loved one has suffered a stroke as is in the condition your dad is now in, time is of the essence. Well no matter how difficult all of this is for now, try to focus on when you are w/your dad w/the pureed food you prepare for him.

I understand this situation, as my dad who had cancer towards the very end of a his life suffered a stroke. He was hospitalized. Meanwhile, the DPOA's-mom, and then my brother; I must include my sis-the controller were all arguing one day in front of dad who was unconscious by now in his hospital room. I was so angry at them that day, and advised them to at least leave the room while they were having a heavy discussion about legal issues. Even though dad was unconscious, I felt or thought maybe he could hear what was going on! Well, they left the room. I stayed with dad and really this was to be my last time there w/him. I said little things in his ear. Dad squeezed my hand as if indicating he knew I was by his side. This for me, was my confirmation that he could hear what was being said.

Anyway, I know it's rough at this time for you. Hopefully while you are at least visiting, it's you and your dad by yourselves. You will be in my thoughts!
Love & Light! Margeaux

Good Morning to Everyone,

It was quite interesting attending the family gathering to see what my cousins remembered about the family so we could start doing more research about them.
Our eldest cousin, who considers herself the matriarch had some info. But she is a narcissist also. I personally was hoping she would stay on track about our side of the family. Her sister, provided us with what I consider more solid information.
She had a document, a birth certificate for the three eldest siblings of my dad.
That was very interesting.

So I started to do an initial search through Ancestry.com. I did find some things there. There's a fourteen day trial offer made, which provides one with more information about people. So I think I'm going to go with that. Have any of you used this, and were you pleased with the service?

But what I did find, were records regarding my dad in a Census. At that time he was married to his first wife. He had five children with her. My siblings and me didn't hear about that family until I was about 10 years old. They started to get married, so we were invited to their weddings.

Dad never talked about details, such as when he was married to the first wife, etc. He did support this family financially. But unfortunately didn't have much of an emotional relationship w/them. We were told stories about how difficult his ex-wife was, on that note. It appears the ex-wife brainwashed dad's kids. There are two sons who did try coming around to visit dad, they must have been in their twenties. So this happened when they were young adults. But the eldest son, (when we saw him at weddings) never acknowledged dad. So of course, we had to bear the brunt of this. Anyway, through that Census, I discovered that dad must have had that first son at a very young age. I think this son could have been possibly 11 or 12 yrs. old when my dad left the marriage. So this could explain why that son seemed so resentful towards dad. This happened at two of the weddings we attended; he didn't say hello to our father. It was difficult enough being told at 10, that dad had a whole other family. It was equally as difficult witnessing his son, ignoring my dad and sensing that dad didn't feel good about that. But I remember the fact, that for I knowing what a wonderful man my dad was, it was unfortunate that things were as such; that his kids from the first marriage became so brainwashed into thinking their dad was a bad guy and had abandoned them. So our family inherited a lot of that dysfunction, I'm sure!

I am certain his ex-wife was a narcissist. She apparently even had three more kids after the ones she had w/dad. She gave those last three dad's last name.
My dad didn't even know about that. All of her kids thought that even those kids were dads. It wasn't until one of the last three was to be married and it was in the days when people took the blood test before marriage, that the truth came out.
Whoah!! The **** hit the fan, over there apparently between dad's legitimate children and their mother.

But nevertheless, it's exciting to find out information about the family. I did discover several new names of great grandparents. That's exciting. When I find out more, I'll share it. Margeaux

Hi Sharynmarie,

Yes, my cousins are very nice women. They like my mom. She being really one of the only elders from the older generation left, so I know they kind of look to her as a mom. Well, my sisters willful attitude, was really what annoyed me.

Boy, the DPOA stuff, is so convoluted, isn't it? Legalities! I really didn't quite understand some of this, still don't know I do, but that post about my brother getting it revoked and re-written so that my sister and younger brother now have it.
I've been realizing what responsibilities kick in, and when they do.

Oh, when I read you post about your mom and the driving test, it made me think, why does an elder in her condition have to go through this? No matter what, poor thing! If only that doctor would have been more thinking and signed that paper for DMV.

Well, you know sometimes when we have people like we've w/ALZ, things just start to unfold and w/o any input on our parts. Hopefully some of the necessary things that need to happen so that you can finally be in charge, w/o the resistance from your mom will happen for you in a good way. Your unbelievable!
Love & Lots of Light Sharynmarie! Margeaux

Hi Austin195,

Oh, Thank You for the hug! Not at all Austin, I always welcome the comments here.
I know you're not criticizing. But I too wanted to make sure that you understood the situation. I know, sometimes we post about things but it's pages ago. We can't remember all the details. I many times go back several pages just to try to keep the facts about lots of people here clear in my head. Ha, ha!

You welcome also. It feels very comfortable here, our community.
Love & Light to you my dear, Margeaux

Well, since standing my ground and ignoring the weird behavior for a week and pretty much spending my days away from home with my kids......I am tired. Because I am tired and want to be alone my husband seems pissed about that. Nice. I feel much like I am being measured by some standard and when *I* need support from people who are supposed to be adult, then I am measured as lacking somehow. I think it is true that when I am exhausted, all the time of counseling etc goes out the window. I want all the so called 'adults' to get away from me. My live in in-laws are just hard for me to bare. They are the grumpiest, non-friendly, non-loving people. So.....I am told by some well meaning folk how they are transitioning and it is hard for them. They have lived with their kids for about ten years now. It is hard for ME. I vent as I hope it is safe to express what I am feeling here. I give a ton of myself throughout the week to the nine kiddos and I am basically not required to do much of anything with the in-laws besides feel uncomfortable in my own home. I am being to hard on them I guess. I actually have said little to nothing but have also heard nothing very understanding of where I am at in return. I see how I don't trust them and I don't trust m husband to understand. Ugh. Vent, vent, vent.

Don't worry BW, I'm definatley watching my back.... tried talking with one of them this morning... I left that situation feeling like I had been projectile vomited on with WORDS.... about 20 seconds into it, I knew there was not going to be anything resolved... so, just to shut her up, i said, "your right... you are right about everything"... she just looked at me.... I told her we needed to have a professional front and to hell with the rest of it, and that I would not be havng any more conversations with her.... period... got up and got busy and she left....I only have to see this one for a few minutes in the mornings to listen to report, so I can do that....
And as far as the family is concerned, they already have an opionion of her, the daughter has told me not to worry, she will elimintate herself....
So thanks for the replies and for listening.... it will all work out... hugs to you all...

Mom29,

You hit the nail on the head, that "family wants something for nothing."
Yes, I'm really learning to exercise my boundaries w/my controlling sister.
Many years while growing up around my sister, I must admit, that I didn't show her that it is wrong for her to interfere to the point, even to make me feel bad, about her bad behavior. Well, I'm learning to be stronger in this area. I guess, one just basically gets fed up w/all of this nonsense. Yes, it does ruffle feathers when they think you're being reasonable! Thank you, for pointing these things out. Margeaux

Ok, I get what you are saying BW. The only thing I know to do is document your work, stay as far from their drama as you can. Management usually knows who the trouble makers are unfortunately as you said BW, some good workers leave because they don't want the stress. In my experience, usually the troublemakers quit or if one of them quits, the other stops causing drama because they have no one to buddy up with. My husband worked with a woman who wouldn't follow policy and my husband was the shift commander. He warned her several times. She started shooting her mouth off that my husband was harassing her. Because his job is security for one of the labs in Livermore, they take this stuff seriously and an investigation was done. It all came back to her shooting her mouth off about my husband along with the documentation my husband had on her and she was given the option to quit. Hang in there Ladee, document your work and be aware of what they are doing.

Hi Austin195,

Maybe I didn't explain myself in regards to the living situation. I do not pay my mom rent, as I do not live in that household. I live with my husband across town in an apartment. So when I was writing about that, I meant, that I have my own responsibilities, separate from my sister, in my own household. She's the one who lives at moms. Part of this was born out of the fact that she was selected as POA. At first our brother who was totally irresponsible, and wasn't taking care of business; we know for sure helping himself to our now deceased's aunt's and mothers money. But he wasn't tending, nor looking out for the welfare of two elderly women at that time.
Mom was already probably in stage 2 or 3 of ALZ, and her sister had congestive heart failure.
Prior to this, mom had been taking care of her sister. But when the diagnosis of ALZ became known to us, things began to change. Mom took a fall and landed in the hospital. Meanwhile her sister was also admitted; she had an infection on her foot, because she was borderline diabetic. Before the doctor's would release her and my aunt, they by law only released both of them to my brother's care. So this basically meant these two elderly woman could no longer be alone in mother's house. After this, my aunt had a falling out w/my brother, basically because he wasn't hiring anybody to do the caregiving, and he, nor anyone in his household was doing it either.
occurred.
Now, my aunt (who had charge of legal matters), switched the POA to my sister,
and younger brother. This is when my sister moved into mother's house w/her two daughters, and one daughter brought her then boyfriend w/her. Well, the daughter w/boyfriend moved out last year and married the guy.

Anyway, the history w/my sister w/regards to money, especially family money, has been she sought out loans from my parents, and that narcissistic aunt in the past to buy property. My sister rented a three bedroom house from the narcissistic aunt for about 15 yrs., and I know my aunt was not charging her high rent. In other words, my sister has relied heavily upon financial favors from the immediate family. So I sometimes think that possibly my sister feels some kind of indebtedness towards them. But she also owns two properties, (which she rents out). So I believe my sister has a strange relationship as to how she views people, say like my cousin and even me, who are not as financially set up as she is. This is why I feel that my sister is trying to do this strange game on my cousin, of asking her to come and spend the night w/mom, if needed, but she wants it for free.

Oh, and I'm fully aware about it is really not a good idea to work for friends, family and all of that. Once the friend or family dynamics changes into employer-employee relationship, things change. I've been there, done that, not with my sister, though. Anyway I just wanted to clear this up. I completely agree w/what you said about the daughter. Really, SHE's the one my sister should be putting some pressure on about helping. Thanks Austin, Margeaux

Ladee, I know you emphasize that they really do properly care for M and S. I'm not saying that you should be running to the daughter/son of this personality clashes. I'm just saying that you need to watch your back. They will be trying to undermine you from all fronts. Be aware and figure a plan of action. That's all I'm saying.

Ladee, what you are experiencing is NORMAL co-worker environment! (Thank goodness it's just only me and my 2 bosses!) I know this from my siblings when they get frustrated (like you are). My siblings are all hard workers. Younger bro is in Virginia - having to do with navy ships. Oldest sis works in library. Younger sis works in a college -admin dept. I tell you, all of YOU have the same complaints. You all work hard. Then the slackers or the newly hireds does things and complain. Bro is not teaching them correctly (he does but they're lazy, not listening, etc..) Younger sis is not processing their requests (well, if they turned in their paperwork, I would do it.,...) Oldest sis gets blamed cuz newly hired is not doing their work properly (It's really not my job to teach them, that's the front desk. Still, I did teach them but...) Get it? And all 3 DO worry about their position because sooner or later, other people will believe these .. uhm.. troublemakers.

My conclusion based on my siblings: as long as you are a hardworker, it will reflect badly on the slackers. Therefore, the slackers will do their best to make you look bad, and make themselves look good. (And from both sisters - theh have lost some very good hard working coworkers due to these troublemakers.)

Solution? Sorry...my siblings are still trying to find one (and are still stressing a lot!) I hope that the daughter/son continues to believe in you and not the troublemakers. The thing is, Ladee, you cannot remain complacent. Because if those 2 can get the others to see you their way, then eventually daughter/son might wonder if they are right that you are a troublemaker.

Anyone here with work place experience on how Ladee can handle this situation? And NOT look like she's jealous or spiteful?

Thanks Sharyn.... I see what you are saying, no, they take good care of M and S... no complaints there... this is personal.... I know I was rambling when I first posted... trying to sort out my own confusion about why I am letting these two get to me so bad... and I am not concerned that M or the family is beleiving anything they are saying... it is that they are triggering the old feelings of being the scapegoat in my family dynamics...I am able to seperate this situation from the feelings... the feelings are old... I am even able to seperate their need to 'get along' as opposed to just going in and doig their job.... It doesn't matter to me if we like each other... I am 62 yrs. old... that part is not important at all... see, that's what I was saying about it being crazy making and guess I am not conveying clearly what I am feeling or even trying to say......
But I truly appreciate your feedback.... but I have no problems with the way they care for M and S, tho M has made it very clear she does not like the overnight girl...... but I do not engage in conversation about them with her... I let her talk, and keep my personal issues with them to myself....I don't even tell the daughter about this mess, it has nothing to do with the care of M and S....
No doubt there is a lesson for me here... so I'll try to focus on that... thanks for the reply... hugs to you....

Austin~My mother has Alziemer's and a personality disorder. My sis and I reported her to DMV because we believe she should not be driving any longer. Her dr. would not do it so we finally mustered up the courage to report her anonymously hoping DMV would honor that and they have. She received the notice from DMV last week which she had to take to her dr. He had the opportunity to revoke her license himself, but instead he stated that in his opinion she should not be driving which now makes it DMV's decision to revoke it. I understand that he wants to maintain a dr/patient relationship with my mother and is giving her the chance to prove she can drive, but it is also causing her a lot of anxiety and stress that I had hoped would be avoided.

Ladee~I am sorry you are having to deal with this mess. I know from reading your posts you are a very caring, loving person especially with your charges. So these two are determined to make you out to be the person who has nothing to do with what is going on. I don't want to offend you as I have a lot of respect for you but is it possible that you are very enmeshed with the care of M and S? What I am trying to say is that your standards of care are higher than their's because of experience. You have great people skills, you put so much of yourself into your work and these newbies are not on the same page as you are because their emotional growth is not on the same level. I only bring this up because I have notice on my job, that I have some issues with younger people who seem to slide by when I get held to a higher standard. My issues stem from the fact that when I was their age, no one took me under their wing. I had to learn everything the hard way and that included getting fired a few times. What I started doing was first I took into account whether my boss was unhappy with the 20 somethings work. If the boss did not seem to have a problem then I knew it was something within myself. Unresolved issues with siblings who made me look bad to our parents, teachers or other adults? Dear friends through jr. and sr. high that I found out were talking crap about me behind my back? I took myself too seriously and expected others to do the same? I wanted to be respected and acknowledged for my accomplishments? I found that I wanted to be respected and acknowledged because these were the issues from my childhood that I never was validated on. It is very possible this is a growth experience for you. I have faith you will discover what it is and overcome it. You are a special caregiver Ladee and I would want someone just like you to care for my mother. Bless you and take the time you need to understand your feelings ♥♥♥!!

JLR, I work full-time and care for my 2 bedridden parents. For Years, it was only me and dad caring for bedridden mom. I have 7 sisters/brothers. Nobody helped us - physically or monetary. I have asked, begged, and threatened suicide (soooo tired of caring for parents). No response from sibling. But, in the years that I've been helping dad to care for mom, I would email/text all my siblings of the cost (pampers, wipes, feeding tube milk, toilet tissues, etc...) I kept at it. I vented that everyone had a life - married, children, traveled ...but I was stuck at home, etc....To make a long story short, due to my persistence of texting /emailing /verbalizing in person and by phone, I finally have 1 brother who is consistently sending money monthly – not for the parents –but for ME! We grew up in a very dysfunctional family. The siblings who are now helping, is doing it for me and not for the parents. I’m just saying, that maybe you can do the same with your siblings…bombard them with what you’re going through, the stress of money and paying for bills, etc…Hopefully this will eventually prick their conscience.

I know this is where I am supposed to be posting tonight.... I know ya'll will understand with out me having to explain my feelings....
So much mess going at work, and the old 'scapegoat' role has been triggered.... I was in thereapy for many many years to get a handle on this and learn new behaviours, but funny how being too tired can trigger it all like it was today....
I will try to keep this simple, two of my coworkers are just full of drama, their priorites amaze me, yet it's none of my business as long as M and S are taken care of... and well taken care of ..... all this personality crap is insignificant in the bigger picture of things.... but I am being shown as the 'bad guy' here... some of ya'll know me from other threads. You have a general idea of what my personality is like, yes, I am outspoken, yes I get silly, but ya'll also know how much M and S mean to me... that this is more than a "job' to me.....
This is where it is 'crazymaking" and I know ya'll will understand this part... they are bound and determined to make me out to be this person that has nothing to do with what is going on.... does that make sense????? I can feel myself getting frustrated and wanting to delete this... but I am moving forward because I have to share this or it is going to affect me in my work......
M and S are requiring round the clock care now... so 4 others have been hired to cover it.... but these two young ones, and don't get upset here, there are young folks on here doing an awesome job, things I could have never done at their age....but these two are trouble makers and not really making the quality of care for M and S priorty..... it is more about personalities that caregiving....
I know that our healing is ongoing, and I also know there is a lesson in all this for me... but I totally resent what these two are doing, the things they are saying to M and to the daugher, and I also know M and the daughter know better, so why am I being so reactionay with all this?... am I just too tired to ? I hate these feelings, I have grown way past defending or explaining myself, so that is why I am putting it out here.... the feelings are real, tho not as intense or as paralyzing as when I was younger....why am I letting these two push my buttons, why am I giving them the power to drag this crap to the surface.... ? More healing?
All I know right now is that I resent the hell out of it... but it is what it is... so if any of you have any suggestions I am more than willing to hear them.... I think more than anything I need validation that it is just another stage of healing and that I am not really this bad person they are making me out to be.... and in my heart I know I'm not, this is what is so damned crazy making for me.....
Thanks for letting me share.... I know some of you will get what I am trying to say here, but Iearned a long long time ago, a problem shared is cut in half.... so if nothing else, thanks for listening.... hugs across the miles to you all ...

My family was never dysfunctional until my mother came to live with me. I have 3 sisters. One sister is all about the money and unfortunately for me, my supportive sisters live too far away to help. When I asked my sister (who thinks she's doing a wonderful thing for me when she takes her for about 2 hours every Sunday - guess I should be grateful) if she could take Mom one more night for dinner as I needed some time alone - her reply was - "you'll have plenty of time to be alone after Mom dies"!!!! I work full time and then come home and take care of her. Physically she's "okay", but is slipping mentally. She just turned 85 and I know she won't be here to celebrate another birthday. But, my best friend/sister because of family disagreements, even though I'm siding with her hasn't talked to me in over a month, since she went home. That hurts. It hurts because most of my friends have "left" once my Mom moved in. Screw them and my sisters who can't support me. I can do this. I will do this for my Mom. And when she dies, I will know in my heart and also in my head that I did the best I could for her and I also know she loves me and appreciates me for it. If I have Mom's approval - I need nothing else.

Shary does you mother have to also take a road test why did she lose her drivers license -maybe if she is so anxious about the written test she will not do well with either the written test or a road test and will have to give up driving are there any alternaives available like busses or transportation from the Office of the Aging.

Your cousin has every right to get paid for her services if she wants to have a business relationship with your sister. I'm not sure it would be healthy for your cousin in the long run but that is her choice. It does sound like your sister is trying to get to you through your cousin for being at the meeting together. Your cousin may want to think about this for a while.

My mother is trying to study for the written test but has too much anxiety and can't concentrate, obsessing over everything including DMV possibly taking her house from her. I so wish she would take an antidepressant. I spent some time with her yesterday going over mail which consisted of booklets regarding changes on her retiree benefits and changes on her investments. She thinks she has to read these booklets cover to cover, I keep telling her file them.

Need in order to not have your father drive -can you take him for the test and relate his past driving history because if by some chance he passes a very dangerous driver will be on the road and you would feel bad if he hurt or killed someone and you know of his inability for safe driving-my husbands aunt had her pocketbook stollen from her grocary cart and was so upset because she had all her bank books plus good jelwery in it and was so upset she had an accident on the way home and died of her injuries.

Everyone wants something for nothing especially from relatives. Asking you to do more besides rent is 'saving' money in her mind. Suffer not guilt, ignore and proceed with life. It sucks to get the cold shoulder when you are not 'behaving' as they think you should but what you are describing sounds like you are being totally reasonable. Family is pretty challenged when it comes to reasonable.