Is it normal she's so negative?

Babalou has a point. So does Cmagnum.
I have a friend whose mother always has that kind of drama. As soon as she plans a couple days out of town, mom calls her and starts the "oh, I'm going to die" routine. This friend's mother lives with her son, too, so it's not like she's alone even.
My mom pulls stuff like that, too. My plans, my schedule mean nothing, but her whims mean everything.
Right now it's going into guardianship stuff, with a hearing Wednesday, and she all of a sudden is throwing out tons of flattery to my husband (usually she calls him a greedy thief), and she's saying she wants me to be her guardian (I don't really want it after more than a decade of drama). She didn't even ask me what I wanted, or how we could do this, or how I feel. Just an order.
I suspect she thinks I'll agree to be her guardian and then she can order me around and do as she will. She's going to be really mad in court!

Hello Friends!!! I have had a lot going on lately and my mind is full. I had a few minutes to check in. There are so many new stories I didn't get a chance to read them all. I am so glad this thread is still going even though I have made some drastic changes with my mom. The relief I feel from it is greater than I can ever put into words. All of you were right, if I could get past the initial NO, then it would all be okay--and it is!

Update: As you know, I have stopped contact with my personality disordered mother. She sucked all the juice right out of me. Slowly I am juicing back up and getting myself back. My family is enjoying having "me" back around. I called the AL the other day to do my regular check in on my mom--I only talk to the director. My mom finally did what we all discussed on here.--she moved ALL her money! HA! I find it funny now. Before that worried me, but now I realize she can pay her own way and doesn't need me to do it all for her. She was using me and manipulating me all along. I knew this, but it is hard to admit it sometimes. Especially when it has been going on for 40+ years. I am now FREE from it. No more negative nancy, no more pity party, no more energy sucking/life sucking vampire!! It is so liberating. I still have those guilty feelings wondering if I am doing the right thing, then I remember for a split second how she always made me feel. I am moving forward everyday. One thing is for certain, she is well cared for, she has the money to pay for a nice place, she has great meals and party planners to keep her busy--that is when she will get out of bed and put her negative self out there.

Another tragedy has struck though that we are dealing with. A VERY close friend of my 17 year old son was in a tragic car wreck three weeks ago and has been on life support. He is now coming out of a coma and is in a minimally conscience state. It is so sad. I have been helping with benefits for the family and watching my son and his friends grieve over their friend. Even though he made it through he 10% chance of living, he still has a long road to recovery. He is still non verbal. He was on his way to a school dance and was 2 minutes from his dates house when wet roads took control of his vehicle. He hit a tree and has severe brain injury. My mom thinks her life is bad, but let me tell you, I have seen bad now.

Hope all is doing well. I think of you often and hope you find peace in all your tribulations. When you say your prayers, please add my son's friend to your list.

I asked my wife about this and her repsonse was, yet don't make it into a battle, but say as little as possible. She would not mention hubby for that would open the door to her attacking with "oh my, you are choosing your husband over me" and that would be a war.

Babalou is right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BTW, I typed this this time from my desktop keyboard.

One song put it, not one's own

Dictating a post via my smartphone leaves somethings out. :(

The thing is, try not to make it into a battle. The fact that something is ready for delivery on a certain day in no way means in needs to be picked up that day. It can be picked up that day or any day thereafter. You and your husband's plans are already set. No need to explain anything.

Babalou's ideas are great!!!

That is a very practical way I'm saying damn the torpedoes and actually take no prisoners.

Just say it the way she to put it. Please do not defend it or explain it just state it as a fact. In other words as one's own put it no need to discuss much.

Keep up the good fight! You're making progress! I am very proud of you!

"oh, the dog will be available sfter Novemer xx? That's great, we can pick him after we get back from vacation on dec2. . Gee, no, picking him up on Nov xx doesnt work with our plans, mom. We're not available until Dec 2"

That is so typical of someone with a personality disorder to attempt to mess up other people's plans right near the very time they are to take place. I am convinced this is part of their illness and really should not be enabled.

See if there is some way to have her looked after so that you too can go on on this much needed already plan for trip. She has cost you and you two enough!

Frankly, she cannot handle you having anyone else in your life other than her. You two, mother and daughter, need to get an emotional divorce.

I realize that I'm not you. However, at this point my patience would have completely failed. I would feel very tempted to say a line from Gone With the Wind and a line from the Wizard of Oz to express both intention of not putting up with these games anymore and some anger too. However, that's me, not you.

Thanks to both of you for writing back. I feel better today. Some days just grab me and I feel so scared and vulnerable. P.S. My mother took her shower without calling me and was just fine. 😀 I am glad she takes precautions.
My mother has so many emotional needs that I never know whether she is trying to lay on a guilt trip on me (she has done this all my life) or if it is real. You know... The boy who cried wolf. It makes it tough. I want to make sure she is ok but also need to detach emotionally. Tough road to navigate. Some days she is so excited and happy--almost manic and other days verydepressed. Will not take any pills for the mood swings.

She has found a dog she is waiting for from a breeder, and the wait has been long. The dog just had puppies and my mom is due to get her in about 6 weeks. (Just about the time my husband and I are supposed to be on a short but highly needed three night vacation we have had planned for months...) Anyhow, as she gets older and more forgetful, it makes the emotional detachment a bit more difficult, but my counselor is helping me a great deal. So are you guys! XXOO

Nijny, there's nothing wrong with being concerned about your mother. You worry about a fall, which is logical. Imagine if she did fall and break something. That's worse than a bit of worry!

Thanks for the update. It's a mixed path of messy ups and downs which become less wide in range over time. You are right, you will be with this therapist or a therapist for several years.

If you have not gone to bed yet, guve your husband a big hug, a warm kiss, try falling asleep with an arm ir two around your husband thinking about your best memories together and when mom's voice in your head goes off, tell her you have your own spouse and go take a walk or whatever, but just go. Remind yourself as needed that you're a grown who is married and no longer mommy's little girl who is not grown up enough to have her own life with a married man as his married wife. I would tell you to say to her what my wife's pastor told her to say to her mom that was the same thing someone told me to say to mine. I have, but I have told you more politely the basic underlying message.

Basically, dam mom's torpedoes, snuggle up with hubby and remember yall's good times and take no prisoners in your goal of a good night's sleep. Nite!!!!

Hello friends--I wanted to give an update. I want to share my progress made but also my steps backward. I am so frustrated when I feel like I am losing ground instead of gaining it. The counselor has helped tremendously and I think I will see her for quite a while to come. I had to skip this week because I was so worried about a health issue my daughter had. It was a tough week all the way around. But, I am leeping a journal and really have made many steps forward.

I have been doing great not needing my mother's approval so much and not catering to her every need. But today was a big step backward. The stress of a zillion other things didn't help. i honestly think that most of the problem is me. She is who she is (often, but not always, narcissistic and cold and unloving) and I am the only one who can fix it for myself. So why am I still struggling? The big but stupid issue of the day is me worrying. I spent the morning with my mother and she was "extremely tired." She told me she was going to take a shower tonight. I told her that my husband and I would not be around--she likes to call me before she takes it and when she gets out in case she falls. She hasn't fallen n the shower before, but she is ever so careful about all possibilities surrounding herself. This carefulness probably serves her very well. So she told me not to worry about her tonight. I said, "But I do worry." She said, "Well, I am telling you not to." Then I did and said a few more things that annoyed her and here I sit wondering if she is angry with me again. I cannot believe I am worrying like this. I thought I was past it. So... I believe I will get close to my goal of not feeling like she is my "constant job," but now I feel as though I have pushed the end goal of my emotional detachment farther away all by myself. What in the world is wrong with me? Some days I just disgust myself! Thanks for reading.

Sometimes we need to remind ourselves of that! It's not within our "locus of control"

Agreed. That is what the psychologist said. She wanted me to remember that what my mother thinks is up to her and I have no control over it. She has her own thoughts and emotions and I have mine. AND MINE COUNT!!! Thanks. Babalou!

You have no control over her anger or sadness. You have your emotions and she has hers.

Hello everyone--

I continue to make progress, but still working hard. I felt as though I had a major breakthrough this past week and the psychologist agreed. I am connecting more than ever with my "inner child," and keeping my emotional distance from my mother much more effectively. I am not used to this! It mostly feels great, but also sort of sad. The other day, my mother and I had a very long conversation after she accused me of saying something I did not say. I eventually went over to check on her and when I entered she was sitting, sort of deeply sleeping but not completely. She mumbled she was trying to kill herself by no longer eating. (She has a pretty good body weight and that would certainly take a very long time...) We started conversing about what I said that was bothering her, and she felt a little better, but manwhile I had an idea to record our conversation on my phone. I listened to the recording a few times in the evening until my husband told me to stop and erase it, which I did. But is was worth all the listening. I noticed a few things--my mother is starting to slip cognitively more than I realized and I now know there is no hope whatsoever for us to ever have a true and meaningful relationship. That ship has sailed. I also learned that she just did not ever really see me as a separate person. The discussion was so long that I couldn't begin to describe it all here, but by asking her some questions, I realized that I absolutely cannot fix her. (Like you all told me!!) No wonder all of my ridiculous, herculean efforts haven't worked all these years! No wonder I haven't had a nurturing mother--she just cannot be that person due to her own issues. It was like an epiphany. I am now trying to balance what I need to do to help her while protecting myself from her verbal onslaughts. She continues to be mean but also periodically confused. i have to learn how to deal with that a little better. Today she told me she could feel me distancing myself from her, and she is right -- I am, but I didn't say that. Her expressed solution was, "Now I need to distance myself from you..." and not ask me for another thing, besides what I already do for her... Her nastiness is intact for sure, but she is somehow more vulnerable. I have to work on keeping myself steady and in control as she gets more confused and angrier.

But here is the really good news-- I hardly call her anymore--she calls me, and that seems to work better. I am not rushing over there all the time--I am trying to skip a couple of days per week and only go over once a day when I do go--she lives in a duplex, not a senior independent living place. (I used to do a ridiculous amount of work to try and please her or make her happy with me...) I am keeping a journal, and... well... I feel different--not so connected to her. I think I am on the road to recovery, but I never thought it would happen. So, once again, thank you, and keep wishing me well. I am undoing a lifetime of "brainwashing," but it is actually happening. I guess a good way to sum it up is that I am still concerned and bothered when she is upset and angry, but I no longer perform as her super-woman or her whipping post. Nor do I think I have done something wrong for which I need to be forgiven when she is angry. That is major. Thanks, friends, you are making a huge, huge difference and I am getting better!

Hi back at you! Glad things are getting on track.

Hi! I actually had a pretty good weekend after a tough week. You all helped! I am moving forward and making some progress. Keep your fingers crossed for me! More later...

NJ, your mom is in Independent Living, right?

When my mom was in IL, I visited once a week. I rarely spoke to her on the phone. There was a doctor on site several times a week, so she could get herself to the doctor if there was a problem. There was also a geriatric psychiatrist who visited her once a month for management of her anxiety meds.

Just a little reality check for how often someone else checked in with an elderly mom in a facility where there are always people around in a real emergency.

I am on the west coast so the day is early. Thanks for checking on me--I love my new friends! I am doing pretty good. I have decided to ask the psychologist with whom I am working to focus on behavioral changes I can make, in addition to rescuing and helping my inner child. Like I want to have her work with me to put a limit on how much contact I have with my mother. It is a slippery slope with me, so I want to focus on increasing my "fun" time with my husband and friends and decreasing the time I spend with her or on the phone with her. You have all helped me recognize my important need to sort of reformat my life before it is too late. My husband is already appreciating all of the great advice I have received. :-). He is worth it, and so am I. So for the moment I am doing pretty good. I am hoping I feel the same way later today, tomorrow, and forever. Ha! I gues one step at a time, or maybe three steps at a time--I am getting older and don't have that much time to waste! Thank you so much!

So, NJ, how is it going today?

Good to here you are smiling! Believe it not, amidst all of the books about romance for men about women, I saw a very unique book in a hospital gift shop of all places. The title is really surprising "Romancing Your Husband."

Men tend to view romance different from women. So, it might be very interesting to ask your husband what he thinks is romantic. Hopefully he will answer you and ask you what you find romantic.

Then, ya;ll go out for a romantic night that included some from each list. Be creative, unwind, and have fun! Who knows, but ya'll just might have such an enjoyable and refreshing time together than both of you might find yourselves feeling much younger because romance can be so re-energizing.

There is one more book that comes to mind, but I think I've said plenty. Unwind and enjoy being a wife again whom I'm sure he will enjoy and feel closer to you again for.

Have fun, but don't feel that you have to tell anyone about it for it's not like your date, dating, but your dating-married which is no one else's business who is on the outside.

I think romance in marriage is part of one's own private world that is to be enjoyed and kept alive as well as protected.

Your children will be glad to see a sparkle in your eyes once again and it will be good marital modeling for them. As true as that it, do so primarily just for you two!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My wife and I have been married since 1988 and we were in our early 30's when we got married. . We continue to find creative and fun ways to be a fun loving couple! Ok, that's all the suggestions that I'm go to say for each couple must create their own private life in their own way.

I love it! Thanks for great ideas and making me smile! Awesome!

One more idea for your date and I promise that I'll shut up. This remark may be too late at night. But, anyhow this idea could be used later for another date. Go buy some massage lotion and give each other a massage.

Do what CM says..go out on a date. If this man has hung on while you talk to mom who upsets you multiple times a day, he deserves to go out with his wife tonight. If there's an emergency, mom will call you. And perhaps you'll be too engaged to answer the he phone.

If it's a real emergency, she'll call 911. If it's not, it can wait til the morning. This is called setting boundaries.

Go out and eat supper with your husband and see a movie or go to a night club and dance. Basically, get out of the house and find something that you and your husband can do that will absorb you're attention.

Here's a wild idea just the two of you go out and have a good time on the town but spend the night in a nice hotel. In other words go out for a date. I think too many couples stop dating each other over time.

Thank goodness for all of you. I have not yet called her back. I did speak to my husband, and I told him everything I said. He is an incredibly kind and gentle man and he told me he was glad I told her what I did. That she was an adult who has behaved like this since he has known her for 20 years and that she needed to hear all of it. Then why do I still feel sick? (This is a great weight loss regimen--let me tell you!)
CMagnum--I go to counseling on Tuesday and I have to wait until then. The cost is prohibitive if I go more often, but now would indeed be a good time. Babalou--you are so right--I cannot have a conversation with my mother. There is no such think. It is continually walking on eggshells because I never know what to do or say--it is like walking on a tightrope that has hot spots! My mother lives independently. If she were in assisted living, somethings would be much easier--others might be harder, but at least I would know she had someone with her. Linda--you are so right. She will fight to the deth to maintain control and I must find balance and set boundaries. I am working really, really hard, you guys. I guess this is the most challenging part of my recovery. Not giving in to my inner child who wants desperately to have her approval and get that pat on the head. I do think I did not need to say as much as I did, but her coldness and complete disregard for my feelings just caught me at the wrong moment. She is so cold when she is like this. I remember my father who said to me shortly before he died, "She can be so cold...so cold." My poor dad--when he had ulcertive colitis, and my husband and I were visiting, she wanted to shame him or somethihng and asked in front of us, "Did you make in your pants again?" She was often so horrible to him.

Okay--this is scary and I do not know how it will end, but I can honeslty say that I have given my all--as much as I could, until I am literally losing myself. I cannot do this anymore. I wish I weren't so scared and I wish I knew what to do next. Do I call this evening? I always talk with her multiple times. She can call me 5-11 times per day. Do I go over there this evening and check on her? Do I not do anything and hope for the best? I am trying so hard, but I might weaken by later today. Thanks for hanging in there with me.

njny, this is a process you're going thru and taking a few steps backward is normal. No one will do this only taking steps forward - we're human and the situation is fluid, especially at the person you're setting boundaries with is in reactive mode.

Your mom's options are to see a doctor or just let things be, there's no magical Door #3. You suggested that she see a doctor, she refused and that's her choice. Often narc moms will bring up a problem, only shoot down the options for resolution of the problem because they don't actually want to solve it. They're mentioning it to elicit sympathy, guilt, whatever. cmag is on point about the counseling - often whatever personal info you divulge to your mom will become a way to zing you later.

Please try to fight the urge to call and say whatever you have to to make her nice for that moment. She's trying to get back the control she sees slipping from her as you start to find your balance and boundaries.

Do not call her back. She asked you a question and you gave her an honest answer. In normal relationships, that's called a conversation.

When you are engaged in a relationship in which you never, ever, ever get it right, say or do the right thing, it's time to 1. Stop being friends with the person, 2. Get a divorce or in the case of its being a parent or child 3. Set firm boundaries. Behave as if your mother is a normal human being and don't walk on eggshells.

Is there a nurse at mom's assisted living? If she hates going to the doctor, perhaps she can consult with the nurse.

njny1952,

"I never knew if I was supposed to be her -----"

I realize this is tough, but that's too much to worry about. So, try to just be yourself. She's not going to change and seeking to reason with her accomplishes about as much as spitting in the wind.

Do fight the urge to call her back. Also, there is no need for you to tell her anything more about your getting counseling. That and probably other things in your own life likely don't need to be told to her.

You have bigger roles in life to be about. I hope you will hang in there. When do you see your counselor next? Would your insurance allow you to see them more frequently? Sounds like you could use the extra support right now.